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 Post subject: Being ok without sex
PostPosted: Tue May 10, 2016 9:53 am 
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Joined: Sun Jan 03, 2016 9:10 pm
Posts: 30
My husband is wonderful and right on track, and I'm so thankful. But sometimes I feel just so sad, lonely, angry and ugly at living in a marriage without sex. Rationally I know it is not what is "missing" from our marriage, but emotionally and physically it is a hurdle that I'm constantly struggling to get over in my mind. We talk about it and he thinks it is something that will come eventually, with the work he's doing, but how sad is that for me. And I feel so selfish for wanting more from him than he can give right now.


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 Post subject: Re: Being ok without sex
PostPosted: Fri May 13, 2016 7:56 am 
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Joined: Sun Sep 14, 2014 1:34 pm
Posts: 661
Kalamazoo - Are you being selfish wanting a sexual life with your partner? No. Of course not. This is a normal, healthy, reasonable, human want. Is he being selfish not having an intimate sexual life with you? At a minimum, he's being immature. I think sexual anorexia, which I experience, is a form of selfishness. It's being unable to give, to be in the moment, to be loving and playful, to connect.

I have learned, and it is an incredibly painful lesson, that being so kind, so understanding, so empathetic to my husband (who was living a secret life of betrayal and lies), was so misplaced and so self depriving. Putting my needs last since I thought I needed to be an understanding wife....that has led me to 30 years of deprivation. Oh, how I wish I had not done that.

I think healthy sexuality is the last thing sex addicts will learn. That's just my opinion. But, they've used sex as a drug and avoided intimate connection so to turn around and have a healthy, intimate sexual relationship in reality with a real human being...I think that will take some hard work and personal growth.

In the meantime, it is very, very hard to deal with sexual anorexia. I can empathize. I don't have a good solution, but feel your pain.

dnell


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 Post subject: Re: Being ok without sex
PostPosted: Sun May 15, 2016 1:47 pm 
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Joined: Tue Apr 15, 2014 5:45 pm
Posts: 45
I felt the need to really morn the lack of sex that had happened in the years my husband was majorly acting out (2 years) and the 10 years previous to that when subtle sexual needs were dismissed because of the SA fragile ego. As an example, I told him the way I wanted to be kissed and I was hoping that could be a conversation into us both fine tuning our sexuality and growing together and it did not---to say the least. In my opinion we diminish female sexuality to the point of absurdity in this culture. Don't ever doubt your own need for sexuality. Also, I need to say that I decided on an "in house separation" and exploring sexuality outside of our marriage. This was one of the best decisions I have ever made. It isn't so much that there is "Mr. Right" out there. Indeed, there are a lot of sex addicts and it is the same old story. However, it puts me more in control of my sexual experience which I choose with intention and with joy.

As another point, I feel that sometimes within the interaction with the SA I started to question whether I was really a sexual person. Indeed, I felt I was "acting the part" during sex and there was a lot of shame in that. When I became independent celebrated my sexuality as my own. I own it and I love it!!!! I also began to look upon my sexual past in a new way. I did everything from writing erotic stories for my husband to buying him stripper heels for Christmas (for us together). When I learned he was a SA, I felt pathetic like he was probably laughing at me inside. However, then I came up with another view on things: What a vibrant, beautiful, sexual woman….. wow!!!! I never have to look back and guess if I had wanted our sex life to work. Also, I have contemplated what it would be like if I met someone who exhibited the same behaviors I had sexually-- creativity, vulnerability, perseverance, love…. wow, I'd be thrilled!

Smile at people(men and women) and notice how they smile back. Your sexual self and your essence is most likely glowing. Bask in it. Show it to the world -- even if you do decide to stay monogamous. As a side note, I have been reading a book called "Vagina" by Naomi wolf and it has some in depth chapters about female sexuality. For example, a female arousal/relaxation pattern happens with all kinds of things we dismiss as a culture (eye gazing, cuddling--gets us close so we can "smell" men, etc.) . My heart goes out to you.

Remember, its not you… its him. You decided upon marriage/partnership to have him be the sole person that reflected your sexuality back to you through the couple hood. His "mirror" is warped though SA behavior.

Last tip… set up your environment to treat yourself like a sexual queen…. candles in the bathtub… a night alone… whatever you need!


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 Post subject: Re: Being ok without sex
PostPosted: Mon May 16, 2016 12:58 am 
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Joined: Tue Apr 12, 2016 3:22 am
Posts: 163
So true, I am so sad,and now angry,that for over thirty years, I suppressed and denied my sexuality,because my husband desexualized me, subtly and over time with all his actions and words,made me feel I was oversexed,or pressuring him,he had every excuse in the book, till I stopped dressing like a woman or wearing makeup due to it making me feel sexual and then not being able to bear the rejection. Now I dress and wear makeup for myself, I get compliments and feel sexy,I suppose perhaps had I realised in my youth what was going on i would have left, but at18 you just believe and put the blame on yourself,I too tried everything, I am open, uninhibited and tried everything, to try to have a full,fun sex life ,buying sexy heels,clothes for husband in the foolish belief he would open up and have a true intimacy,I was totally open to anything, bought all sorts and initiated what I had found out my husband fantasised about.at times told I was a purvy,even while he was requesting the same scenarios from strangers or dominatrices online. So I too know it wasn't for trying, he totally rejected me being part of his secret sexual needs, he played the part of tired non sexual husband for years,while acting out..even to sending me to get lunch mid sessions,so he could gratify himself while i was out of the room,then saying he was no longer in the mood..it has been devastating to my sexual needs and self esteem. Now I know I never had any problems, it saddens me that all my life I sacrificed my sexual needs and sexuality .i have no urge for casual sex, I always longed to be trully loved and desired and to have a fun,satisfying sex life,but having delved into his dating sites..i know I would end up being used and objectified by seeking sexual needs, at least I can say I tried, he cant hold the frigid,no fun, not interested,or prudish card over me.


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 Post subject: Re: Being ok without sex
PostPosted: Mon May 16, 2016 1:11 pm 
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Joined: Tue Jul 01, 2014 1:38 pm
Posts: 67
I can totally relate. When the SA couldn't do it I actually felt sorry for him. So for 15 years I went without it. Never strayed, never even fantasised about straying. Put it down to the antidepressants and just accepted that wasn't in my life anymore. Of course, I know now that it was PIED and I was just starved of my sexuality while he feasted on every type of porn and cybersex to feed his risk addiction. And now 2 years plus after dday I don't even want to have sex with him or anyone else because he has dehumanised it for me. Its just body parts now. And although I know he loved me in his own selfish way and never consciously chose to become compulsive, its hard not to feel cheated betrayed and abused. It sucks. But at least I don't have to waste any more of my life wondering what's wrong with me or him. He was the problem in almost every area of our life together. And that's really freeing.

_________________
'The only real failure in life is not to be true to the best one knows'. Buddha.


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 Post subject: Re: Being ok without sex
PostPosted: Mon May 16, 2016 8:51 pm 
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Joined: Sun Sep 14, 2014 1:34 pm
Posts: 661
These are really powerful responses. I agree we do NOT want to lose our sensuality. I also agree that my self esteem and positive feelings about my sexuality were damaged by my husband. I'm angry I let that happen, but I have forgiven myself. I'm very angry at my husband about it. And, yes, I felt sorry for him as well. I've thought about that and my husband really carried so much self pity. I guess I kind of believed that and didn't want to make him feel worse. What I didn't realize was it was a toxic self pity based on entitlement and selfishness. And to think of the excess he pursued while starving me, and BLAMING me for his lack of interest and ability. It really does suck. Wish I hadn't put up with it and gone through it.

I believe that my husband actually fears sex. That is, real sex with all the vulnerability and uncertainty, and yes, pleasure that comes with it. He's definitely terrified of connection. The objectification and fantasy and fear or reality, it still stuns me. At best, I do see it as an immature response to the challenges of life. At worst, I see it as exploitive, disgusting, dehumanizing and grim. I can see the intoxication, but I can't see any real satisfaction. And, I can really see the desperation, helplessness and hopelessness and the shame. Ugh.

But, I have worked hard on giving up all those lies and I feel so much better about myself. I wish that for all of us.

dnell


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 Post subject: Re: Being ok without sex
PostPosted: Wed Jun 22, 2016 4:54 pm 
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Joined: Tue Dec 30, 2014 12:20 am
Posts: 131
Thankyou all for your stark, and honest perceptions of your sexuality. It doesn't matter if your 18 or 48 or 68, women tend to tie their sexuality to that 'one man' and the subtle rejections certainly have done a number on us all!! I thought I would grow old leaving my sexuality behind and foolishly thought my husband was doing the same. And yes, I am still stunned to think of what was going on in his secret world all these years. I look around and now see sex addiction in the behaviors of most men I know. I am just so saddened by the cultural downward spiral in how the American Male views women.....or was it always this way?!?!?

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It is always OK in the end...if it's not OK, it's not the end!


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 Post subject: Re: Being ok without sex
PostPosted: Wed Jun 22, 2016 5:38 pm 
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Joined: Sun Sep 14, 2014 1:34 pm
Posts: 661
Kajer, I think the internet and its easy access to unlimited porn has made things much worse for women and girls. And given the access to high speed internet, it's worse than ever. I do believe we have it worse now with more men then in the past becoming addicted.

It makes me shudder.

dnell


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 Post subject: Re: Being ok without sex
PostPosted: Thu Jun 23, 2016 12:23 pm 
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Joined: Thu Apr 18, 2013 11:38 pm
Posts: 515
hi Kajer,

I agree with dnell, that the Internet and all the porn that's come with it has prompted a dramatic increase in the number of males who participate in this kind of behavior/addiction.

However, I also see it as a 'convenient' effect of what's been hundreds of years of patriarchy and dismissal of women. THe underlying misogyny that pervades the thinking of so many sex and porn addicts surely contributes to the issue. In the past, we saw this misogyny manifest itself through physical cheating, beliefs around a woman's specific, appropriate 'place' in society, etc. The internet, with everything from porn to web cams to easy/hidden hook ups with others has made it much easier for people to live out these sorts of attitudes, well into a repetitive behavior. Although RN teaches us addiction is an issue of emotional immaturity and inability to cope with one's emotions, my personal opinion, after too many years of researching and observing this myself, is entitlement and misogyny are strong co-morbid or parallel issues that either fuel, or give justification for, the addict's behaviors. This underlying entitlement must be addressed in addition to the addictive, repetitive behaviors, or else the attitude will show itself in continued disrespect and undermining of us as partners.

Just my two cents ;) Not worth too much!

meep


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 Post subject: Re: Being ok without sex
PostPosted: Thu Jun 23, 2016 3:07 pm 
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Joined: Tue Dec 30, 2014 12:20 am
Posts: 131
Wrong, meep....your 'spot on' opinion is worth sooooo much more than you think!!!!! Thanks for stating it!!! I also need to speak out more!!!

_________________
It is always OK in the end...if it's not OK, it's not the end!


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 Post subject: Re: Being ok without sex
PostPosted: Thu Jun 23, 2016 6:31 pm 
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Joined: Sun Sep 14, 2014 1:34 pm
Posts: 661
I agree...spot on Meep Meep. My husband sees/saw (who really knows yet...) women and girls as things. He truly believed that women exist to serve men..him in particular; to serve him sexually, emotionally...to pick up after him, take care of him, fill him up while all the while being "pretty enough" and "hot enough." He believed it was his god given right as a man to stare and critically evaluate all women and their worth based on their appearance. Our value was only surface and only if it pleased him. Our feelings were irrelevant. To him, it was always and only about him. In his mind, I should have been in ecstasy just by serving him.

To stare at us, to fantasize about us without our permission, to not give a rats about our feelings, our dignity, our worth...I can only end up at hatred. To fantasize about other women while having sex with your wife or partner? In my mind, that's abuse. Objectification is so ugly and dehumanizing.

My husband finally does get his misogyny. It took him two years to finally get that insight.

My husband used to take the clothing catalogs I got in the mail and flip through them and evaluate the models and get sexually charged. Think of the power he had to determine the worth of these female images. He loved to masturbate to Victorias Secret catalogs. When I look at Victorias Secret ads now, I see how young the models are. They're teenagers with breast implants posed in porn positions. It's truly ugly.

dnell


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