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PostPosted: Thu May 01, 2014 11:48 pm 
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Joined: Thu Apr 03, 2014 8:20 pm
Posts: 18
I'm currently in an in-house separation with my severely sex-addicted boyfriend of 15 years. It's only 7 weeks since discovery. I understand I'm supposed to be working on my healing and separating myself from his recovery (which is SO HARD, because I'm a control freak on a good day...but I'm trying my best.) The problem is, we are best friends, so we're having these deep conversations and FANOS talks (has anyone ever done those?) with periods of laughter, fun and dare I say it...bits of joy. These moments often immediately trigger me and I fall into a deep depression over what I've lost. It's so fresh still...but the happiness is under there somewhere. I just don't like when we feel "normal" though because it's not normal anymore and I don't feel he deserves it.

Then there are times when we kiss/hug/cuddle or I even allow him to sexually pleasure me (he is on a 90 day abstinence regimen mostly to try to "re-wire his brain" from porn....and plus I'm not interested in having sex with him anyway due to the situation). I have allowed this mostly because I want it! He was sexually anorexic for years with me prior, so there are times when I feel it's just unfair that I continue to be neglected and it just plain feels good. To be clear, he's not pressuring me and I don't feel this has violated any boundaries. I have no idea what is going to happen to our relationship and to be honest, if I was a gambling woman I'd bet we're not going to make it through this...but still it feels normal and natural to be sexual with him again. Is this something I should be avoiding?

And if so, then am I just supposed to live in this house completely detached and ignoring him? And not laugh or connect? Should we even speak? Because that sounds miserable but if that's really what's healthiest for me, then it would be much easier if I wasn't living here. However leaving again will probably be the final nail in this coffin....there is only so much a girl can take.

I'm stuck and confused and trying to talk to him about this has ended in tears every night this week. Any insight would be appreciated.


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PostPosted: Fri May 02, 2014 9:05 am 
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Joined: Mon Nov 15, 2010 11:49 pm
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Hey Veronica Blue,
These are choices for you to make according to what is important to you. My husband was my best friend before we started dating and eventually got married, that role of good friends is something we tend to fall naturally into as well. You mention that you're falling into a deep depression afterward. If this were me, I would consider if that was a price worth paying. Take him and what he "deserves" out of it. Some things I would consider. When you have happy moments together, are you violating any values? Are you being honest about who you are (both in the moment and overall)? Are you building a relationship that will need to be (painfully) dismantled later on, or are you simply enjoying yourself with what you have available to you at the time. It's okay to be happy and enjoy yourself. It doesn't invalidate the pain or trauma that you've experienced. Is he using this time together to attempt to convince you to change your mind or manipulate you in any way? I would use those answers to determine if that time was worth it

VeronicaBlue wrote:
Then there are times when we kiss/hug/cuddle or I even allow him to sexually pleasure me (he is on a 90 day abstinence regimen mostly to try to "re-wire his brain" from porn....and plus I'm not interested in having sex with him anyway due to the situation)

Some information and some questions about this to consider. First, he is receiving sexual stimulation from pleasuring you. So, at the least I know my therapist who took us through our 90 days would consider this to be a violation of the abstinence regimen and I believe (although I'm not certain) that RN would caution him against it as well. That is mainly something for him to be concerned about, but if you are supporting him in his recovery attempts it's something you need to be aware of as well. If this activity is hampering his recovery, how do you feel about your role in that? When you are sexual with him are you accepting him as a whole person, or objectifying him - in essence using him for sexual release? Are you using these opportunities to be in denial about where your relationship is?
VeronicaBlue wrote:
if I was a gambling woman I'd bet we're not going to make it through this...but still it feels normal and natural to be sexual with him again.
This here suggests that you might be escaping dealing with some of the losses you have experienced (and anticipate experiencing) by pretending like things are "back to normal." If you are, it's important to be aware that you are simply postponing that grief, and possibly compounding consequences.
VeronicaBlue wrote:
am I just supposed to live in this house completely detached and ignoring him?

There is nothing that RN is going to tell you that you are "supposed" to do, other than what you feel is the best thing for your healing. If something is derailing your stability or healing, we would advise you to change that. You are still very early in the healing process and workshop, so my best advice to you right now is to do what you feel is right for you and keep working through the workshop. As you learn more about addiction, you may want to come back and revisit how you are interacting, or you may decide that you're happy with the boundaries that you have set. Make the best decision you can make for now and then fix it down the road if you need to. One of the other mentors has a favorite saying, "Give yourself the gift of patience!" It's always good advice. Be Well,
Mrs. Jones


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PostPosted: Sun May 04, 2014 7:36 am 
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Joined: Thu Oct 10, 2013 3:34 pm
Posts: 92
VeronicaBlue wrote:
with periods of laughter, fun and dare I say it...bits of joy. These moments often immediately trigger me and I fall into a deep depression over what I've lost. .



I have struggled with those moments too. It's like, even with the acting out (back when he was not considering himself to have a problem and een in the very early recovery stage) we could still have these beautiful moments, laughing together, or cuddling watching a show, teasing and playful moments even, even after all that has happened, to still have those moments made me feel so sad, feel such loss. I would think'if it can be like this, how sweet, how awsome could it have been, should it have been, if there had never been the addiction? It's gotten better, for me. The more I learned, the more I shared my fellings on another support forum, and as I went through RN, the less that has been a problem. I Know I can't dwell in the past, can't hurt myself with those 'coulda been' thoughts. I see what is, eyes wide open now. I would never want to go back to having them shut.

keep being strong


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PostPosted: Wed May 07, 2014 11:15 pm 
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Joined: Thu Apr 03, 2014 8:20 pm
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Ok, so all physical and emotional contact has pretty much ceased in this house. He came back from his brainiac therapist last week and suddenly had this notion that him pleasuring me and having to stick to his 90 days of abstinence was a matter if me "punishing" him. Never heard or felt he thought this before this therapy session, this whole thing was his idea! And it was a good one that I really respected.

For the record, I'm not punishing him. I don't feel ready to have sex with him AT ALL now and after this...I don't know if I'll ever be. It's just not something I was even worried about, I thought those times we ended up making out and if he ended up sexually stimulating me in any way that it was natural and finally felt like he wanted me. I thought "finally after all this time, now that the porn and prostitutes and bullshit is out of the way, I finally can feel the old him again....the one that wants me." Which is horrible in it's own right. But now that he's saying that was all to punish me, im right back to feeling the low self-esteem of him "not wanting me" at all!

It's a shame because I know it's not true and he probably always "wanted me" but all this addiction shit confuses everything. Now I don't even know how to talk to my best friend in this doomed house. I'm trying my hardest it try the "detach with love" method but I think it's coming off as cold and distant. I don't know how to do any of this and I hate it.


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PostPosted: Thu May 08, 2014 7:47 am 
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Joined: Thu Oct 10, 2013 3:34 pm
Posts: 92
I can understand not being comfortable with sex. Listen to your body, to your needs. Give yourself the time and space you need. As far as detaching with love goes, I know what you mean there too. I just pay attention to my own thughts and feelings and consider my values and boundaries. If giving him a hug today feels 'risky' to me, then I don't give him a hug, even if yesterday I did. It's a process, sometimes you have to take it day by day, even hour by hour. I can still have days where it it's minute by minute. I am not exactly far enough along i my own healing to be telling anybody much of anything, but I feel comfortable with sharing my experience with a particular issue and what works for me. If it works for somebody else, fabulous, if it doesn't resonate with you, no problem. So, often in the past I was afraid to engage in certain levels of intimacy for fear of setting myself up for more heartache. It has gotten alot better for me. As always, I come here to read and have gotten so many insights that have helped me to figure myself out and put things in perspective. be well.


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PostPosted: Thu May 08, 2014 9:04 am 
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Joined: Thu Oct 11, 2012 2:02 pm
Posts: 420
What you are experiencing is likely the immediate gratification that goes hand in hand with addiction. There is no "truth" to an addict; whatever makes them feel the best, or better, in that moment is what is "true" to them. So while he is sexual with you, the "truth" to him, if you ask, is that he is doing it because he really wants to. Then, when he doesn't get what he wants, or his counselor asks him questions that make him feel uncomfortable, and the easiest way to relieve the discomfort is to say you made him do it, the idea that you made him do it becomes his "truth." In both situations, what he is saying is "true" to him. To anyone outside, it is clear that both cannot be true, that he chose to pleasure you, and now he is choosing to blame you. Since he operates out of his emotions, not his reasoning, he will fight you to the death to preserve whatever version of "truth" he needs, in that moment, to feel the way he wants to feel.

How the addictions starts and grows, is from this kind of warped isolation, where the person only cares about or considers the moment they are currently in, and what they "need" to be able to endure that moment. If they were thinking long-term, they wouldn't jeopardize everything of value in their lives for a cheap thrill.

As far as coping, these behaviors can make you feel crazy - like everything you think you know is subject to shift and change. When I quote some of the things my husband said to me early in recovery back to him now, he denies he said it - he will even argue that no one would say something so completely illogical, so he can't possibly have said that. Of course, putting me through that kind of crazy-making arguing is one of the things he is now ashamed of, so he has a hard time admitting how much of it he did. It is essential in these instances that I have the confidence to trust my gut, to trust my memory, and to recognize that while he is not trying to intentionally hurt me, expecting rational thinking, consistency, or stability from him (especially about these matters that are intensely embarrassing to him) is only going to interfere with accepting my reality and creating stability, rationale, and consistency for myself. I am now the expert on my own life experience. If I need validation from someone else, I go to a trusted friend, or the RN forum - especially in early recovery, he will have little more to offer you than instability.

I will say - and I know you've experienced this, too - there are or should be increasing moments when the man inside shines through. I am not saying you can't enjoy those moments (in whatever way is keeping with your values). We actually had a lot of good times together, as my husband emerged from the cloud. He was feeling better physically than he had in a very long time, he was seeing sunshine and joy where he had not seen it before. He was even seeing me, and what I had to offer, through fresh eyes. Those good times, however, sometimes lured me into hoping he was further along than he was, so our next crazy-making spiral came as a heartwrenching surprise when it shouldn't have. These habits die hard, even once the acting out stops.

Trust your gut, you are your own best adviser. It will take time to get used to that - and maybe to get good at it, too.
thebagholder


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PostPosted: Tue May 13, 2014 3:12 pm 
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Joined: Thu Apr 03, 2014 8:20 pm
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I just wanted to give gratitude to both of you, jacki3030 & thebagholder. Your experience and wisdom about immediate gratification/struggles with detaching was exactly what I needed to hear last week (and I'm seeing that it still holds true this week.) I'm sure it's going to be this way for a long time, working through the deeply ingrained intimacy issues, being indecisive in the most extreme sense of the word, etc. I'll take both of your advice and go at my own pace, and try to trust myself more to be my friend and advisor. I also much stop beating myself up so much for having basic feelings of unease when it's my life partner has betrayed me so.

Thank you so much for inspiring me to keep trucking along with the workshop. Doing lessons 7 & 8 today...


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